tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post8003943513697699176..comments2023-11-02T07:13:53.064-07:00Comments on Beervana: How We DrinkJeff Alworthhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02930119177544342495noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-25787093144051198932010-02-28T14:33:38.527-08:002010-02-28T14:33:38.527-08:00I came of age during the shift, and yes, there'...I came of age during the shift, and yes, there's a difference. My peers in high school and college drank swill, so I missed a lot of what passed for socializing.<br /><br />Now, I'm married to a sometimes brewer and love great beer. I love beer so much that the first few sips is my favorite part of the experience, and getting buzzed is counterproductive. Almost twenty years after our Matinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-43227480377934466932010-02-19T00:27:57.458-08:002010-02-19T00:27:57.458-08:00"I will pose this for the assembled critics: ..."I will pose this for the assembled critics: do you agree or disagree that there is now a competing culture of beer connoisseurship that focuses on tasting beer and enjoying one another's company"<br /><br />I will whole heartedly agree. But focusing on the taste of beer,and the people, has nothing to do with how people imbibe. When I go to homebrewers meetings I pour short samples Jaredhttp://www.theweeklybrew.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-92000467550858821172010-02-18T19:49:55.955-08:002010-02-18T19:49:55.955-08:00Wow, Jeff! Good thing your didn't bash any rel...Wow, Jeff! Good thing your didn't bash any religions! ;-}dr wortnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-26809399366843548122010-02-18T18:48:52.030-08:002010-02-18T18:48:52.030-08:00I liked the post, especially the closing paragraph...I liked the post, especially the closing paragraphs. Sure it's a little light and anecdotes don't make data, but not only does Jeff know that, he acknowledges as much in the post. So he overplays his hand and there might be a confusion over who's matured, the author or the beer scene. But he's not the only one arguing one-sidedly. Those that deny that there is now a beer scene Jimhttp://csasylum.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-45136815251324268782010-02-18T17:09:41.941-08:002010-02-18T17:09:41.941-08:00I think your post is well written and accurate. T...I think your post is well written and accurate. There will always be idiots that "over-consume" but my experience is that craft beer enthusiasts are generally responsible drinkers. Man has consumed alcohol for a very long time - - I am fed up with people on their moral high-horses that preach of the ills of alcohol, especially when done while thumping a bible. If you want to see someAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-38806710838824222352010-02-18T16:22:38.229-08:002010-02-18T16:22:38.229-08:00Jeff - I hate to tell you you just may be getting ...Jeff - I hate to tell you you just may be getting older and not hanging out at the same places you once did. There's a lot of overconsuming pale yellow beers with well whiskey backs still going on, perhaps not in the company you keep. Going to agree with other commenters on the ABV as well, we just don't need to drink as many 6.5% beers to get the same effect as a 4%.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04710639359486087618noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-45755564030011581492010-02-18T16:09:25.781-08:002010-02-18T16:09:25.781-08:00As stated before, I agree with your contention tha...As stated before, I agree with your contention that there are outlets for beer (and other alcohol) consumption that may be considered competitors to poorly lit barrooms where drinking to distraction is the norm. That there is a focus on connoisseurship I'm not so sure about, but we certainly have opportunities to drink many different beers whose flavors are far more varied than what comes outMarkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07522969360434191018noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-18750480010545099992010-02-18T15:53:26.840-08:002010-02-18T15:53:26.840-08:00Jeff said: “For those forty and over, I would love...Jeff said: “For those forty and over, I would love to hear you explain how the multitude of all-ages brewpubs, some with kids rooms, had an analogue in 1980.”<br /><br />For “Brewpubs” there is not an analogue. Brewpubs are much better today and I love it. However, in “restaurants” adults could certainly imbibe with the kids around.<br /><br />Could you not just as easily teach responsible Mr. Murphynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-75771115832102895672010-02-18T15:42:23.832-08:002010-02-18T15:42:23.832-08:00Jeff, I agree that there is now a competing cultur...Jeff, I agree that there is now a competing culture of beer connoisseurship that focuses on tasting beer.<br /><br />However, I believe the "enjoying ones company" part has been around forever and includes drinking macro and watching the game, drinking whiskey at the VFW, drinking pints at the Horsebrass, etc., etc., etc.Mr. Murphynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-46379348203137502502010-02-18T15:38:51.924-08:002010-02-18T15:38:51.924-08:00Wow, hot topic, Jeff. Good read. Comments, too. It...Wow, hot topic, Jeff. Good read. Comments, too. It think all points are well taken. I recently befriended a guy who just turned 21 and he reads beer blogs and drinks craft beer. When I was 21, I was seeking out bang for bucks like Mickey's. I love craft beer, and I love the effects of alcohol (to a certain degree). To each his own. I better get a beer.Angelo De Ieso IIhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12924074136432149767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-35661836314540876942010-02-18T15:26:45.248-08:002010-02-18T15:26:45.248-08:00I particularly like this part: "Mostly we dri...I particularly like this part: "Mostly we drink our beer in well-lighted places where we can see and smell and enjoy it--and each other."<br /><br />I know how I'm supposed to read that; but to the 10 year old homunculus in my head, it sounds like "... we drink our beer ... where we can see and smell ... each other." Maybe that's why Oregon beers are so strong? So weAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13765538992002748487noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-29625902083644338352010-02-18T15:24:22.777-08:002010-02-18T15:24:22.777-08:00Most drinking beer are not doing it for the buzz. ...Most drinking beer are not doing it for the buzz. That is a myth, and only something you see at younger, more trendy and less expensive 'hangouts'... $1 night for PBR... etc.<br /><br />Yes, growing up as a kid, the Grandparents split a 40 oz. of Bud w/ a bowl of pretzels a short while after dinner... while my Dad would be part way into a suitcase of Hamms.... drinking until he got DOSiRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08406354869646971733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-40077286752964441292010-02-18T15:17:12.258-08:002010-02-18T15:17:12.258-08:00Jeff, though I tend to agree with you, I'd lov...Jeff, though I tend to agree with you, I'd love to see some numbers supporting it. Get crackin' on that government study grant!<br /><br />That said, would you agree that drinking behaviour at festivals is something that's outside the bounds of your thesis? Intoxication at festivals seems to be what they were, are, and have always been intended for.Richardhttp://www.calyxdesign.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-3794940649663258682010-02-18T15:03:07.457-08:002010-02-18T15:03:07.457-08:00All right, it looks like I'll have to look at ...All right, it looks like I'll have to look at some more statistics and do a follow-up post. Like Gladwell, my softly-padded, anecdote-rich post has convinced no one.<br /><br />I will pose this for the assembled critics: do you agree or disagree that there is now a competing culture of beer connoisseurship that focuses on tasting beer and enjoying one another's company, or not? Because Jeff Alworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02930119177544342495noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-38175506513789344252010-02-18T14:55:15.612-08:002010-02-18T14:55:15.612-08:00"I think you could legitimatly say many craft..."I think you could legitimatly say many craft drinkers in their 30's and up are in it for the beer. But I'd still say the younger people are in it for the buzz."<br /><br />Nothing like painting with a broad brush. I'm 24 and I, like many friends of similar age, drink because we enjoy beer, not for the buzz. If anything, I'd say that the younger generation is MORE Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17259080486625766300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-88235084947909036212010-02-18T14:35:43.201-08:002010-02-18T14:35:43.201-08:00Sadly I have to disagree with your assessment, Jef...Sadly I have to disagree with your assessment, Jeff. The only people that are drinking fewer beers are doing it because the beer is stronger now (me included) or they are just getting older. <br /><br />I personally think it is a solid fact that the majority of people drink to get buzzed. Whether it is a young person openly getting drunk or an old veteran drinker that has learned to hide his buzzMr. Murphynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-79269503491258476972010-02-18T14:16:43.660-08:002010-02-18T14:16:43.660-08:00Saying you only drink beer for the taste is like s...Saying you only drink beer for the taste is like saying you only read Playboy for the articles...joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14190744835642613081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-31184144867995904622010-02-18T13:52:10.374-08:002010-02-18T13:52:10.374-08:00Oh Jeff, you better hurry and put a new post up. T...<i>Oh Jeff, you better hurry and put a new post up. This ones not going your way at all.... ;-}</i><br /><br />Indeed. But I've been blogging long enough that I've come to fear no comments much more than getting beaten on by engaged readers. <br /><br />However, so far I remain unpersuaded--despite the passion--by Jared and Hugh.Jeff Alworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02930119177544342495noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-60471226782730555642010-02-18T13:51:58.545-08:002010-02-18T13:51:58.545-08:00I, in fact, was confused by the Gladwell piece. I...I, in fact, was confused by the Gladwell piece. I am not quite sure what it was saying other than culture determines how we drink. Well, thanks for that.<br /><br />He discusses both the regular but social and moderate drinking ala the italians of New Haven, and the Bolivian falling-over-drunk-major-two-day-long-bender session. So exactly what is the result of culture? I suppose it is either Patrick Emersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17242234148546323374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-43721102436077122522010-02-18T13:19:22.109-08:002010-02-18T13:19:22.109-08:00As I read this post and the New Yorker article, I ...As I read this post and the <i>New Yorker</i> article, I asked myself, "Would any of us drink beer or wine or liquor if it did not have the mind-altering affect that it does?" I don't think so. We can wax philosophic about all the many benefits of social drinking and how alcoholic drinks were safer than water not so many years ago and the like. But, along with the social and Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07522969360434191018noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-59797179149874703442010-02-18T13:12:12.707-08:002010-02-18T13:12:12.707-08:00Oh Jeff, you better hurry and put a new post up. T...Oh Jeff, you better hurry and put a new post up. This ones not going your way at all.... ;-}dr wortnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-24830044591270155972010-02-18T13:06:25.052-08:002010-02-18T13:06:25.052-08:00You can't be serious! Jared is 100% correct. L...You can't be serious! Jared is 100% correct. Look at the Holiday Ale Fest, Oregon Brewer Fest or any other local fest! 10% of the beer aficionados attend and drink they're samples and leave. The majority of the rest linger all day drinking pint after pint of 6-10% beers. Yea, that's responsible drinking! It's more of a drunk fest than a drink fest.<br /><br />"The Oregon Hugh Johnsonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-36954239235623569852010-02-18T12:50:37.035-08:002010-02-18T12:50:37.035-08:00I'm not sure things have changed all that much...I'm not sure things have changed all that much in 25 years, though my experience with drinking precedes yours by a good bit. I do agree with your point about cultural norms and the influences they have on drinking. However, the Gladwell article points out that drunkenness itself is not moderated by culture, but the deleterious affects may be. His citation of the Camba society drinking Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07522969360434191018noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-36151882966541573432010-02-18T12:49:06.715-08:002010-02-18T12:49:06.715-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07522969360434191018noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21271644.post-9736802242643025552010-02-18T11:05:11.053-08:002010-02-18T11:05:11.053-08:00Whitewashing? I don't think so. I'm talk...Whitewashing? I don't think so. I'm talking about the "competing cultural model" which I don't think existed, at least not among beer drinkers, even 25 years ago. The effect is that, over time, the habits of the population of Oregon has changed. We drink less. Gladwell's point is that you can't mandate this through laws; it has to be cultural. We drink less Jeff Alworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02930119177544342495noreply@blogger.com